No Signal Quality except on Astra 19 degrees East

[sat_man]

Hi all,

For two years I have had multi satellite viewing using a Motek motor and a Triax 90 CM dish. Most channels were good quality but some weaker ones tended to break up especially where fast moving scenes were involved (pixels). I decided to invest in a Tiitanium .2db Universal LNB removing my old cheap .6db version which had served me well. When I changed the LNB I lost tmy favourite Eutelsat bird and the other satellites on the arc although I had not moved the dish. I then decided to invest in a 1 metre Funke disk based upon good right-ups as to it's performance.

I have spent many hours trying to align the new dish to no avail. I can get around 57% signal strength on Astra 19 degrees with around 60% signal quality. I cannot get signal quality on any other satellite only signal strength. I have tried three different LNBs (2 titanium and a MTI Blue Line) with little or no improvement.
I can only get ASTRA with signal strength. I removed the Motek and tried to set the Funke dish up as a fixed dish until I can lock onto 1 degree west after which I would re-fit the Motek. However even as a fixed dish I cannot get anything (signal quality wise) other than ASTRA. Having spent many an hour moving the dish I am now very frustrated (I had no such problems two years ago when I set up my Triax & cheap .6db LNB.

Having tried 3 new LNBs it would appear that LNBs can be ruled out. The new dish itself cannot be an issue so only the alignment can be at fault (unless the experienced amongst you know otherwise). I have no obstructions in front of the dish so that is ruled out. I have a Humax 5300 receiver but that seems to be working as expected. Have the experienced amongst you any tips as to what could cause the 'no signal quality' issue? I would be grateful for amy useful comments / suggestions.

Thanks in anticipation

Brian

[BGonaSTICK]

Hi sat-man, welcome to Satellite Help

You obviously have some idea of what you're doing, and have tried many of the obvious things.

Frankly, I've not heard anything good about the Titanium LNB, and so wouldn't like to comment. The MTI is good, but there have been a number of instances of failure.

The systematic replacement technique is a good one. The LNB is not looking to be the prime candidate at the moment, but don't rule it out totally.

My advice would be to temporarily swap out your receiver. Even an old digibox would be fine as long as you either align the dish at 28.2E or pick a suitable transponder (SR 27500 or 22000) elsewhere and 'Add channels'.

It's a known fact that some tuners don't like some LNBs.

Also, try running a temporary new length of coax out to the LNB. Think systematic replacement here

Alternatively check cable for water or other short with a meter. Replace F connectors.

Some other causes of poor signal quality can be found in this thread.

Poor orientation or presentation of the LNB to the dish face can cause poor quality. You say the dish is new and undamaged. Are you sure? A small twist can knacker it and be quite hard to detect.

Not wishing to sound patronising, but have you assembled it correctly? Were there any options to mal-adjust the boom arm position?

Did you adjust the skew when you set it up as a fixed dish?

Have a think and a play, and get back with the results. We'll get the bu99er

STICK

[sat_man]

Thanks stick I will try your suggestions one at a time.

The titanium was highly recommended in another forum which is why I bought it. I got the titaniums from Ebay (which could mean that they are rejects I suppose). The MTI from SatelliteSuperstore but none of them fix the signal level issue. I bought good quality cable last year and it was working well until I switched to the lower db Titanium LNB. The dish looks perfect but I will check it out again (I still have my old triax dish just in case).

The Humax 5300 is now 3 years old but still gave me a good display until I changed the dish / LNB. I removed the cable from the LNB while the receiver was still on. Could that have upset the receiver. It still appears to work ok but could I have impacted on it's performance by fitting and removing and re-fitting the cable from the LNB several times while the reciever was on? It was to save me climbing up and down the ladder all the time.

I was thinking of getting a Techomate 7755 from Ebay as it would give lots more functionality than my old Humax. The Ebay Technomate is £97 new and it is patched. The seller (high customer satisfaction comments / rating) states that he is a Technomate dealer and offers a one year Technomate warranty on the receiver. However when I contacted Technomate they said that they will not carry out repairs under warranty on a patched receiver. So I am not sure whether to switch or stick with my old 5300.

Thanks for your comments.

I will report back.

Brian

[BGonaSTICK]

Yes, get back after a few more tests. Checking the dish for deformity isn't easy. You could do with a large perfectly flat surface to lay it face down on to start with.

Removing the cable at either end with the receiver powered on is not a good idea, and can damage both the tuner and/or the LNB. Normally you get away with it, but it's not something you want to plan to do.

The lower 0.2dB noise figure of the Titanium is laughable IMO. In reality, it's probably nearer 0.4dB, so don't take too much notice of what it says on the box. It should work OK, but I guess there is an outside chance of it being a 'duff' or rogue batch. Unlikely though.

If your cable is nearly new, just test it and swap or re-do the F connectors. The slightest misplaced thread of outer braid can ruin a perfectly good setup.

The most revealing test I think you can do is to swap out the receiver. Try the Hummy on another (sky?) dish, and a digibox (or whatever) on your dish. That will immediately halve the number of possibilities. I like those percentages

You can forget the factory warranty on a patched box. The only comeback would be via the seller. Of course, depending on what goes wrong with it, you might be able to reload the factory firmware before sending it back. The patch won't give you much on the Technomate, so I would be inclined to sit tight for a while, assuming your Humax isn't fried.

Is your 5300 patched?

Do you have or intend to get an HDTV in the next year or two?

[sat_man]

Thanks again Stick,

For the advice on the dish / LNB and the receiver. I will try again this weekend.

In response to your questions:

My Humax 5300 is not patched.

I have no plans for HDTV for the near future. I will wait until prices come down before I take the plunge.

Brian

[BGonaSTICK]

No problem. Good like Brian

I really want to know what it is now too

[sat_man]

Hi all,

Another 5 hours on my garage roof trying to get some signal quality. I tries 4 different LNBs (2 x titantium, 1 x blue line and one cheap amstrad). I tried using a signal meter that I had bought off ebay. That found the satellites but no signal quality. I moved my dish all over the place very slowly (both up and downwards) lots of signal movement but no signal quality. At 7.30 pm tonight I was about to give up and I to call in an engineer to see if he could crack it when I did my last dish sweep of the horizon and pick up signal strength and quality. I was hoping that it would be Eutalsat but it was Astra 19 degrees East. (I locked onto France 5, OLTV, OMTV etc on 12207 frequency). Pleased to have achieved some signal quality at long last I gently moved the dish to get the best settings (the best I could get with the Funke 1mtr and the Blue Line LNB was 61% strength and 97% signal quality (yes signal quality). I the tightened up the dish keeping those strength / quality figures then, without moving the dish, I changed the Blue Line .3db LNB to the Tiitanium. The signal quality remained the same but the signal strength jumped up to 68%. Is the 68% signal strength acceptable for a good quality display? I know that signal quality is most important and 97% is good but should I expect better that 68% signal strength from the powerful Astra 1H bird?

I have not fitted my Motek motor back on yet so I am setting uo as a fixed dish until I see what the best results that I can get are, then I will try to replicate them with the Motek back on.

I want to find 16 degrees east tomorrow night (weather permitting) Hotbird. However I am worried that I will merely lose Astra and still not find Hotbird at 16 degrees east. Can I leave the inclination as it is and just swing the dish round 3 degrees? Or do I have to move to the right and also up or down to find Hotbird due to the arc. It would be easy to move to the right but if I have to loosen the up / down bolts too then I may just lose the lot again. at least with the Astra results I know that my LNBs are capable of pulling something but it may be that Astra is very powerful and I may get worse results on Eutelsat (Hotbird is what I really want). Any advice gratefully received?

Thanks Brian

[Analoguesat]

Well done Brian. The first sat is always the most difficult and frustrating.

Mark the current dish postion with tippex, pencil, or wax crayon BEFORE you move it. Then if you get hopelessly lost you have somewhere to start from again.

You will have to raise the lnb as you track southwards. half an inch should be plenty between 19E and 13E. The HB7A tp's are at least as strong as the Astras so should be faairly easy to find.

Eutelsat W2 is a strange beastie in that the tp's powers are all over the place. When you are searching make sure you are tuned into one of the tp's carrying the fta Bulgarians. they are as strong as anything.

[BGonaSTICK]

Hi Brian, glad you're making progress.

Signal strength will vary quite a lot on most satellites, depending on which transponder you're tuned to, so check our list of strong transponders here and pick a channel on your receiver to match. Don't trust the figures on the receiver too much, just use it as a relative guide. All receivers are different.

You mention Hotbird at 16E. Hotbird is at 13E, and is as easy to find as Astra 1 these days if you pick a good TP.

Eutelsat W2 is at 16E and can be a pig to find if you choose the wrong TP.

Keep going. I know it's frustrating, but you're well on the way by the sounds of it. Just mark your current position well!

STICK

[sat_man]

Thanks guys for the tips. I will try them out tomorrow weather permitting. I will raise the arm 1/2 inch approx and try to locate 13 degrees east. I will let you know if it goes well.

Brian