Gemini Team announcement

[Analoguesat]

With the release of the GP 4.3, we have added a feature to the Blue panel to detect fake Dreambox clones. We want to show our protest against clones and replicas of Dreamboxes. It cannot be in our interest, to allow the fake boxes to hard the big dreambox community and in fact our beloved hobby.
Like some of you should know, some weeks ago a new box came to the market. It’s sold as a completely new development.
But if you check that box exactly, you will soon find out that not only the same images, software and drivers were used, but also the nearly identical hardware, such as for example in the Dreambox DM500. According to some owners of this new box, it is being shipped and sold with a preinstalled Gemini Image, which is not in our interest. Even in the manufacturers forum, Gemini images where posted with a warning “runs only on Box XYZ”.

We as a Dreambox board and Developer of the Gemini Images can’t tolerate this trend. It is not in our interest that our know-how, our knowledge of the Dreamboxes, and our time is used by a third party manufactorer to sell his copies with our software

In fact, the truth is that these manufactorers are themselves not able to provide a self developed image for their receivers.

The Blue Panel server is operated, managed and financed by private funds. Also the support we offer for the Gemini images and the genuine Dreamboxes is exploited by the fake clone developers and owners.

We can not prevent these people from using the Gemini images, but what we can do is making it as hard as possible for these people to gain money with our work. Therefore, we implemented in the images that are also running on the boxes described above a lock for the BluePanel server. The detection mechanism, whether it is a replica or a Dreambox, has been activated in the current DM500 release. Other Box types will follow. If a box is identified as a non-genuine clone of a Dreambox, the access to the BluePanel is locked.
Since this method of detection is still very new, it could unfortunately occur that even genuine boxes are identified as fakes and as a consequence the BluePanel would be locked also on original Dreamboxes. In the meantime, there are some known problems where repaired boxes can’t by recognized as genuine due to the replaced hardware parts. We will do everything the reduce the number of false identifications but nevertheless we cannot decrease the error rate to zero, as the necessary data from DMM is not available. If your Box is falsely identified as a fake box, please understand that we do this in order to maintain the Dreambox community.

We ask all users of our images to do everything possible to ensure that our hobby can live on and we will fight together against such unfair methods. We as developers want our Gemini images only to run on Dreamboxes...

The IHAD/Gemini Team

[ecallawevad]

Bollox,
Dream Multimedia must have pressured you...

Gemini is software, and people sell official boxes with Gemini as well.
I personally like Gemini and it works well on my official box, but I don't like this political crap.
If something is good, you should expect it to be copied, the world is an enterprising place. Though admittedly they should have called the clone something else and created their own brand rather than poncing off Dream MM who have done all the marketing.

[Likvid]

Yes i agree with you, the whole sat scene is just shit these days, i am so fed up with all kiddies on forums and Linux whankers on the forums.

Not the least now CCcam Team has gone the political way now by embedding code so you can not run CCcam from version 2.0.5 on any other boxes than Dreamboxes and i don't like Dream Multimedia as a company either, big liars paying some groups.

I would not be surprised DMM paid the Gemini Team to enable this code as i do know CCcam Team is paid by DMM.

They can keep their cheap plastic Chinese dreamboxes they sell for overprice.

[kerrywez]

Now lads,

Why should anyone put their money into developing an image or EMU, just to fill the pockets of those who are ripping many unsuspecting buyers off. I am fully behind what Cccam amd Gemini are doing and the sooner all those who produce images and emus go down this road the better.

I take the point that if something is successful it will be coppied, if we take that a step further and say Sly's NDS should be made free to everyone, do you think for one moment that the government would allow this to happen, not on your life. Yet what I have just proposed is the same thing, in my eyes, if it is OK to copy a Dreambox and call it a Dreambox, then it should be OK to hack Sly's encryption or copy a designer watch. How would any of us feel if we bought a Rolex for £1000 and found out that it was a sh*ty copy.

If, by making emus and images not work with these copies, we can curtail the production of the copies, then bring it on I say. I do feel sorry for those who have ben ripped off and ended up with a copy, but as they say, buyer beware, sorry I do not have the Latin for that.

There are supposed reputable retailers who are reported to selling these copies and at the full price of original Dreamboxes, how much money are they making out of these rip offs?

You can't tell me that those who sell these copies do not know that they are, because I have been to sites where they are for sale for very little money, sites in China and India, and there is no covering up the fact that they are not the genuine box. It seems,and is more obvious by the day, that every body is out to rip people off these days.

I for one agree with what Gemini and Cccam are doing and wish them well in their efforts. Why should DMM not be protecting their interests, by giving money to Cccam or anyone they see fit, to produce images and emus that will not work on something that is harming their ability to make a LEGAL living from their product?

Very best regards Wez

[robbo71]

It is obviously not OK to copy a Dreambox and call it a Dreambox.
But this action will obviously effect other Linux boxes that are sold under their own name. i.e they are not pretending that they are Dreamboxes.

[kerrywez]

Good point robbo,
But is it fair that all the work that is done for the dreambox should be used for other linux boxes, when they do nothing to assist the development of emus and images. I think that it is good that DMM should supply money to the developers who do the emus and the images, that way we can get better support and service.

It should not be forgotten that the eums and images are for dreamboxes, that they, till now, could be used by those boxes that are not dreamboxes, but undiluted clones of them, is just an oversight on the software developers part. Now that the developers are putting something in their images and emus, that should been there from the start, everyone is up in arms. Look on it as a correction to put right an oversight. I still think that if you want to use software that is for dreamboxes then you should have a dreambox, not a clone or copy. Has anyone ever heard of images or emus developed for Relook or any of the other clones? I thought not, I rest my case.

Very best regards Wez

[jackpot18uk]

Personally, I don't know either way if Dream Multimedia, pay or don't pay pay people like the Gemini team to write unoffical images and Emus'. But the way I see it is the Gemini team is supporting Dream Multimedia. yes I know that under the General Public License that the software or firmware should be able to be used by anyone, what I think the Gemini team have been trying to do is protect the interests of the users and buyers of Dream product. Dream Multimedia are the company who have invested time and money to produce the Dreambox range of recievers and the original firmware, The original R & D must have cost a lot of money, and now they have cheap copies of their recievers on the market, which ones are a lot of people going to buy, yes the cheapest. So Dream Multimedia make no more money, so what happens next? No more new Dreambox recievers. Who's going to spend money on R & D for a new product, when you know it will probably be copied by someone else, who has invested no money at all. So we all lose out. If this happened to every major make of receiver, the makers would not bother making any new ones and our hobby would die.

[kerrywez]

Hi jackpot,
That is the way I see it and I could not agree with you more. I can see where the clone and copy owners are coming from, they will loss all the free support that they were getting and who can blame them for feeling sick, but if they had bought the real deal they would have nothing to be sick over. I really do feel sorry for them, but they will have to make their own software or do without.

We live in a time of copy this copy that and if it looks like it then it must be it. All the bling that is around the necks of some people would, if it were real, break their necks.

I do hope that there will be someone to do all the development for the clones and copies that some have been stuck with, but I fear that it will be in very short supply.

I take no delight from posting these posts, I am just stating things the way I see them, sorry if anyone feels that I am being a pain, but everyone hs the right to say what they feel, as long as it is not offensive or that.

Has anyone here thought just why the DMM800/8000 have been so long in hitting the shops, could it be that they have lost so much income from these copies and clones that they are finding it a bit of a struggle getting the new boxes out? If DMM loss revenue from selling their products, because of all the cheapos on the market, then why should it be a surprise if the new boxes are late. Everyone complains that the boxes are late coming out, but nobody seeks an answer as to why they are late, they just blame DMM for being slow.

Very best regards Wez

[Physcogem]

whats an image, and what is an emu, i maybe thinkin abt a dreambox but very new to this game, still on 19 e anologue. will obviously check with u experts before i buy the box.

[kerrywez]

Hi,
An image is what makes your dreambox work in a certain way. It is not a picture, it is the software the enables the box to function. Some people like one over another, but they all do the same thing, i.e. they make the box work.

An emu is like a cam. Without an emu the image and the box would not be able to clear any encrypted channels. There are several emus and as with the images, some people like one more than another.

An image and an emu are no good on their own, because to unscramble the encrypted channels you also need to have up to date keys in the box.

The easiest image to use would be the Gemini and I suppose most people would use it.

Very best regards wez