Why are Virgin Still using Rom 11s in New Installs?

[TheCoder]

Originally Posted by edcase

AFAIK the rom7 was a motorolla core
All other since rom10 including most N3 cards are ST micro cores and the rom180 is an atmel core.
The 180 may even be different enough to call it N4 (without hacking them how can we know).

All the N1 series cards were ST. ST, however, had an arangement with Motorola to copy the 68HC05 proceesor core which they turned into their ST7 range. The initial Nagra1 Rom series (rom3) were very much based on this copied core although it had various ST extensions, including the MAP co-processor. The Rom7 card used a slightly modified core (new instructions added and a prefetch cache to improve cycle speed) whilst the Rom10/11 took it a little further still. The Rom110 was yet another version of the core with even more instructions added as well as all kinds of nice things like clock pll mulitplier etc.........

[TheCoder]

Originally Posted by leachy070667

There’s only 1 solitary Rom 180 card made its appearance on the forums, with a poster posting the script supposedly extracted from the said card.

Yet considering Nagra 3 is supposedly here, I know off 3 Virgin installs over the last few days alone where subscribers have been provided with a box and Rom 11 card.

Something just doesn’t seem right.

The simple answer is that N3 isn't here yet, at least for customers !

The whole thing is still in very early testing stage which is why i'm suprised that anyone has managed to take a piccy of the new cards. At the moment there are NO customers with these cards, just a few staff testers in some very small test areas.

I might be out of my league here so correct me if I am wrong, but shouldn’t we be seeing new installs with Rom 180s to run along side the soon to be extinct Rom 11s ?

No, cards will be issued when VM are ready. That certainly wont be before the complete N3 stream is fully functional on all channels. There's not even the slightest hint of this being the case at this time !

It just doesn’t make any sense if this big encryption change is supposedly imminent

Thats the problem right there. Your definition of iminent ( a few weeks) doesn't match VM's definition (a few months to a few years) !!!

Do you think this media campaign is nothing more than a simple card change to change all cards to Rom 11s with IPTV around the corner ?

Lets face it you know it would make sense to do it on the cheap.

Why would VM do that ?

Rom10's (and even Rom7's) are fully capable of doing everything a Rom11 can do. VM would be pretty damn stupid to to contemplate such a thing and even if they did, Kudelski almost certainly would prevent them !

We all knew that VM's N1 contract expired at the start of the year and VM would be forced into an encryption change. This testing has been happening for months and has probably been in the planning stage 12 months before that. One thing you can guarantee, it wont be anything to do with N1 or Rom11 cards - they are obsolete !

[leachy070667]

Originally Posted by TheCoder

The simple answer is that N3 isn't here yet, at least for customers !

The whole thing is still in very early testing stage which is why i'm suprised that anyone has managed to take a piccy of the new cards. At the moment there are NO customers with these cards, just a few staff testers in some very small test areas.



No, cards will be issued when VM are ready. That certainly wont be before the complete N3 stream is fully functional on all channels. There's not even the slightest hint of this being the case at this time !



Thats the problem right there. Your definition of iminent ( a few weeks) doesn't match VM's definition (a few months to a few years) !!!




Why would VM do that ?

Rom10's (and even Rom7's) are fully capable of doing everything a Rom11 can do. VM would be pretty damn stupid to to contemplate such a thing and even if they did, Kudelski almost certainly would prevent them !

We all knew that VM's N1 contract expired at the start of the year and VM would be forced into an encryption change. This testing has been happening for months and has probably been in the planning stage 12 months before that. One thing you can guarantee, it wont be anything to do with N1 or Rom11 cards - they are obsolete !

As always Coder you take the time to try and explain things in layman’s terms.


It really is much appreciated you sharing your knowledge and educating others.

Thanks mate.

[andypandy1212000]

Thecoder i love your balanced view and plain speaking, keep it up.

[danny_1888]

friend just had a new install this morning here in belfast still using rom 11 here at the moment.

[666]

Originally Posted by andypandy1212000

Thecoder i love your balanced view and plain speaking, keep it up.

totally agree with you, and hes not patronizing and says it so we can all understand, and he has very good knowledge

[safe-cracker]

Originally Posted by 666

totally agree with you, and hes not patronizing and says it so we can all understand, and he has very good knowledge

maybe he's ricky b himself?

[timetrex]

Theere are too many if's and but's and alot of speculation.

As clued up as the coder is, the only peeps who really know is VM.

With encrytion changes as far as im concerned I cannt see anything happening untill they implement IPTV.

Who's to say they will stay with Nagra? Im not sure but there are a number of different partners they could use and certainely cisco have there own encryption methods as well as a few partnering companiies cisco use to implement IPTV that can provide a new encryption.

[jonesyuk225]

how long before the new encryption will be cracked?

[MorriSoft]

Originally Posted by timetrex

Theere are too many if's and but's and alot of speculation.

As clued up as the coder is, the only peeps who really know is VM.

With encrytion changes as far as im concerned I cannt see anything happening untill they implement IPTV.

Who's to say they will stay with Nagra? Im not sure but there are a number of different partners they could use and certainely cisco have there own encryption methods as well as a few partnering companiies cisco use to implement IPTV that can provide a new encryption.

Has anyone thought of the possibility that the IPTV encryption system will be provided by Nagravision? They too offer IPTV solutions..

Originally Posted by jonesyuk225

how long before the new encryption will be cracked?

Although nothing can be said to be impossible, mathmatically at least, the latest revision of Nagravision (dubbed 'nagra3') is nigh-on impossible to crack with technologies that are available today.

That said, a clever hacker or two may already be close to working this out, simply put we don't know because if someone really was close to compromising the system they would be highly unlikely to voice it to the world until they know it works!

It's been secure for roughly 2-3 years now, so I guess for the time being at least, it's staying that way.

My personal opinion is that only when IKS/cardsharing has been made impossible by providers will nagravision get another visit from the hackers, at the end of the day, there is money to be made and the best way right now is cardsharing, thus, until its dead, nagravision is more than likely not going to be compromised!

Just my 2c.